Winnebago clock
21 December 2021
Description

This clock is in great condition. The paint finish has small cracks in it unfortunately. No chips or real cracks. I have all the original parts. The inside clock elements read: Ansonia clocks co. New York Patented June 18,1882. 41/2 I am wanting an estimate to determine of It's worth getting this clock fully tuned. The clock works but eventually dies shortly after its been ticking. I'd say after a minute. I'm trying to determine if it's worth the cost to fix it or sell it.

Provenance

Unknown

Acquired from
Inherited
For sale
Maybe
Answered within about 11 hours
By David
Dec 21, 14:49 UTC
Fair Market Value
$225 - $250 USD
Suggested Asking Price $200 USD
What does this mean?

Hello Amber,
Thank you for sending in this fine mantel clock to mearto.com for an appraisal.
TITLE:
Cobalt blue with gilt highlights and ream colored ground with polychrome colored flowers on the vine, dual steel springs, eight day time and hour/half hour cathedral gong, hand painted porcelain mantel clock, “Winnebago” model, imported hand painted case (and dial) made on the Continent (most likely by Royal Bonn of Germany), American made movement by Ansonia, New York City, USA made circa 1901-1904. {A well-known mark, often found on porcelain clock cases for Ansonia clocks, says “Royal Bonn, 1755” in a shield. But the maker was Franz Anton Mehlem, who had a pottery in Bonn, Germany, from 1836 to 1931. Some Royal Bonn cases that I have seen bear no mark and may have been made that way to allow Ansonia customers to think that Ansonia made the entire clock.}
PRELIMINARY COMMENTS:
The first catalog which showed Ansonia-made porcelain mantel clocks appeared in 1895, and both the shapes and the colors were unimpressive. However, in the catalogs of 1901 and 1904, a new type of painted porcelain mantel clock become one of Ansonia’s biggest sellers. These were cases primarily made in Germany, mostly by Royal Bonn and Dresden. They were shipped to the USA where Ansonia used their two spring 188s model movement and added a dial. Many of the early dials were unsigned, which for a short time was uncommon (for Ansonia), some had the “A” logo inside two squares while others were just signed at the base of the dial, “Mfg. by the Ansonia Clock Company, New York City USA”, and then many had the name plus the Ansonia logo.
DESCRIPTION:
CASE: 11 1/2" x 9 3/4". This is waisted example of the best of Ansonia sold porcelain clocks at the start of the 20th century. At the apex is a porcelain scroll with volutes representing flowers in cobalt blue with gilt highlights. (The gilt highlights are applied to the case after firing.)
Concave ‘C’ scrolls stretch outwards to the elevated shoulders of the case where foliate scrolls surround the dial, also in dark cobalt blue and gilt paint at the waist below the dial, “concave” scrolls reappear to stretch out the base to reach the well- executed lions heads on either side resting on the curled acanthus leaf feet below, all in cobalt blue. The shaped foliate apron contains pinwheel floral forms similar to those found in the finial. In the small recess below the dial on the façade one finds the use of paint decorated flowers, leaves and vines in what was then called, “New Art Tints” (Green, Apple green, blue and red). All of this was in keeping with the late Art Nouveau era in America (c. 1880-c.1910) which stressed the beauty of nature (both flora and fauna). The flowers are set against a cream colored ground. The sides of the case are fully embellished on all four side sections and the dome like top behind the finial. All are outlined in Cobalt blue with polychrome colors used depicting floral growth in all of the side panel where some of the cobalt blues were used in the design of the flowers as well as surrounding each individual panel. The back of the cases has a gilt tin or zinc painted door with scratched numerals and letters, all from clock repairmen who had work on the movement onside this case. The name of the model ‘Winnebago’ is seen but not the mark of the painter, assumed to be almost certainly a Royal Bonn case made in Bonn, Germany for export.
DIAL: 5 inch diameter dial. This is an off white enameled dial with black Roman hours, closed bar minute track, Brocot aperture above the 12 for adjusting the speed of the clock from the dial side. (Invented by French man Achille Brocot in 1841 and in general use by the French clockmakers staring circa 1850.) There are steel Fleur-de-Lys hands in a style used by Ansonia. (In France Fleur-de Lys hands are made using the fleur-de-Ly pattern on both the hour and minute hand while Ansonia decided to use a type of spear as the minute hand on its American- made Fleur-de-Lys hands.) The ideal neither carries the ‘Ansonia “A” logo, nor is it signed at the base of the dial. (Although many were made this way it is, nevertheless, a slight hurt to value.)
MOVEMENT: This is a skeletonized brass plate movement with posts or pillars holding the plates together with nuts and screws at the rear plate. There is an anchor recoil escapement, fly wheel for striking, two coiled steel springs and the back plate is cast with the name “Ansonia Clock Company, New York USA”. The two springs drive the movement for eight days with striking on the coiled iron gong seen in the view of the base on the hour and half hour. The movement actually has a patent date of June 18, 1882, which is correct since Ansonia decided to put this older tested and true inside the large porcelain cases. One of the legs on the rear plate of the movement reads, 4 ½, which is 4.5 centimeters for the length of the pendulum rod.
CONDITION:
Case – “The paint finish has small cracks in it unfortunately. No chips or real cracks. I have all the original parts.” The tiny lines that appear to be cracks in the paint is most likely cracks in the lacquer or varnish that the casemaker used to cover the paint. This is a called Craqueleur and they do not represent fractures. Having no cracks or especially chips, as you say, is very fortunate.
Dial - The dial although unsigned is in pristine condition.
Movement - The movement appears to be genuine, original to this case and perhaps will function with a proper cleaning.
One further note on the case, which has a wooden board at the bottom which unscrews from the case. With the heavily grained straight lines, this is not pin, nor oak. I believe that the baseboard is made of either beech wood or linden wood, both found in Germany which would solidify that the case was made and hand painted in that country.
Comparables:
~https://www.bidsquare.com/online-auctions/san-rafael/ansonia-porcelain-case-mantle-clock-wampum-1081555 (This is a related model the ‘wampum’ sold in 2018 for $120)
~https://www.invaluable.com/auction-lot/beautiful-ansonia-winnebago-1882-china-case-clock-242-c-a504e1c88e (sold in 2020 for $190)
~https://www.fleetwoodmac.net/vintage/Antique-Ansonia-Winnebago-Porcelain-Cobalt-Blue-White-Floral-Mantle-Clock_124606459338.html (A fully signed Winnebago sold retail for $450)
~https://pics.clockprices.com/20201026/90444519_1_x.jpg (In basic lavender color this sold for $150 in 2020)
~https://www.ebay.com/itm/115104538154?hash=item1accc3de2a%3Ag%3A07MAAOSwQmBhmY29&nma=true&si=mIsWeEDsvCCbbgOdCydyjibEBuA%253D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557 (similar but different models sold recently on EBay for $152)
~https://www.ebay.com/itm/313714186909?hash=item490ad29a9d:g:CyIAAOSwyTRha3lQ
(A different Ansonia model in cobalt blue bought the price up to $255)
PRICING:
The one hurt on your clock is the lack of any signature on the dial. All else is present, the beautiful cobalt blue paint, no chipping of fractures and the right movement. I think you will spend the same money fixing or overhauling the clock as it is worth. The fair market value in today’s market, because it is done in basic cobalt blue is going to be close to $250 ($200-$250).
Retail values run about twice that amount. I do not feel that you have to keep the clock running if you truly enjoy owning it. It is beautiful for its case primarily. The true value of these clocks is in the color schemes, and yours is about as good as it gets.
Thank you for choosing merto.com for the appraisal.
Have a happy holiday and a safe New Year.
My best,
David

Amber chapman Dec 21, 16:34 UTC

Hey David I tried to upload new photos. Did you receive them? Sorry for inconvenience... this hasn't happened to me until now.

David Dec 21, 17:44 UTC

Amber,
You did manage to upload the front of the clock with the door open, but I have lost the image of the movement and another one you sent with the wooden board at the bottom.
Let's try something else, and this should work out fine.
I want you to send me all four photos to another work email that I have for personal use.
It is : horologist @optonline.net
I will let you know if I get all four photos.This will work properly, just like sending anyone an email with some photos. I want to get this appraisal right and not just guess.
Appreciatively,
David

Amber chapman Dec 21, 18:26 UTC

Hey David. I sent 4 photos to your email. I think my problem is that my photos are too high quality so I had to down grade them and send them in 2 separate emails. If you would like me to send more of the clock I'd be more than happy to do so. I hope these images help.

David Dec 21, 18:43 UTC

Good job. I got all four and yes they took a while to load on my old computer.
Last question for you. The word Winnebago is imprinted under the glaze on the back of the cae which is cream colored? No sign of the mark of the painter or country on the back?
I will start on the appraisal now, and look forward to your answer.
Many thanks,
David

Amber chapman Dec 21, 20:20 UTC

Hey David,
The back of the clock only says Winnebago. There isn't any other marks on the porcelain. The actual clack metal has info but that's all that I could find?

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